trek stache single speed conversion

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Trek Stache 27.5+ Single Speed

• Thread starter Jason
• Start date May 27, 2016

JORBA Board Member/Chapter Leader

• May 27, 2016

Jason said: I'm sure I'm forgetting something but that bike looks great and is a blast to ride. Click to expand...

soundz said: I think you forgot the size Click to expand...

Unapologetic Lifer for Rock and Roll

• May 28, 2016

That's a cool bike.  

The Opinion Police

Sweet Jesus That is lovely. My size but sadly not my budget. That B+ fuel is gonna be hot.  

seanrunnette

Brain damaged ray romano.

Glenn Rides After 4 PM CST

Well-known member.

This is sick! GLWS Glad it's not my size.  

Captain Wildcat

I'm not interested in riding a rigid bike with such narrow tires, but I almost want to buy it just so it can sit in my living room and I can pet it.  

• May 30, 2016

That would be gorgeous in anyone's stable. Too big for me but GLWS!  

• Jun 30, 2016

I have started my new project so the Stache is getting stripped down. I'll be selling the frame and fork if anyone is interested.  

A Potted Plant

Honorary sod.

• Oct 20, 2020

Jason said: I have started my new project so the Stache is getting stripped down. I'll be selling the frame and fork if anyone is interested. Click to expand...

The Landfill of Slacktown said: I wonder if you still have the frame Click to expand...

Jason said: I do but built it back up with gears and jones bars and a full bag kit. I'm still hanging on to it for now. Click to expand...

• Best Mountain Bike Reviews

Best Trail Mountain Bikes

Trek stache 7 2017 review.

• Fun Factor - 25% 3.0
• Downhill Performance - 35% 1.0
• Climbing Performance - 35% 5.0
• Ease of Maintenance - 5% 9.0

Our Verdict

Our analysis and test results, 2018 analysis and test results.

Four testers rode hundreds of miles and 128 timed laps on the Trek Stache 7 , 2017 Specialized Fuse Expert 6Fattie , 2017 Santa Cruz Chameleon R1+ , 2017 Salsa Woodsmoke 29 NX1 , and 2017 Kona Honzo AL/DL . We rated them on their fun factor (worth 25%), build quality (15%) and downhill, climbing and cornering skills (20% each). You can find all about this comparison in our Hardtail Trail Bike Review . We also compared these hardtails to the full suspension bikes we've tested in our best trail mountain bike review.

One tester says this bike belongs in the amusement park. He was throwing shade, but amusement parks are fun. Smashing through technical sections at high speeds and taking sweeping corners with so much traction you might as well be on roller coaster rails — the Stache is not a bad time. The grip of the 29 x 3" tires just doesn't let up, and the wheels monster-truck over anything in your way. If you're open to a different type of riding, you're gonna have fun. You just have to figure out if it's the type of riding you want to do all the time.

While the Stache's steering is precise, it takes a while to adjust your line choices to a wide turning bike with such burly tires. The Stache is just too big and heavy to throw around. You've got to be aggressive to work it through tight turns on descents, more so than the Specialized Fuse or Santa Cruz Chameleon . The bars are stubborn, and the front wheel kicks back harder than we're used to if you hit a rock at an awkward angle. On the other hand, if you keep the front wheel aligned with obstacles, you can just sit and spin through pretty much anything with stability and confidence.

Once you've got all that down, the Stache's tall feel and lack of a dropper post still stifle light-hearted fun. The upright cockpit is comfortable for climbing but can be disconcertingly high on aggressive descents. Dropping your body low enough to rip down rock gardens and around downhill turns is a struggle. Also, while the tire squish can make the Stache feel a tad more like a full suspension trail bike, there's no compression or rebound dampening the tires. So you get a running downhill in moon boots sensation at times. It's a weird feeling, but those tires keep showing up for you, making short work of anything in the way.

That same bounding sensation can also be frustrating on the climbs, especially when combined with sluggish acceleration. But the bike's inertia ensures that once you get the Stache going, it holds and builds speed nicely.

The Stache's fun factor is at the bottom of the stack. It's not that it's bad. It's just so very specific in its applications. The Specialized Fuse is fun in a much broader array of circumstances and rates higher. In general, full suspension bikes are more fun.

Downhill Performance

The Stache's big bike feel gives you a solid base to confidently attack descents. It's tractor tires cushion chatter and the large contact patch provides never-ending traction. The resulting stability comes at the expense of maneuverability, making the Stache stubborn about switching lines or working around turns.

The Stache is never described as nimble. It's a hefty green machine to swing around, feeling much heavier than its 30 pounds, 2 ounces. As a result, it requires more planning than a tossable bike like the Specialized Fuse or Santa Cruz Chameleon . The bike's inertia wants to hold you to your first line choice. Your best bet is to stick with it, as the larger-than-life tires will probably roll through anyway.

The other chink in the Stache's downhill domination is the upright riding position it enforces. Again, the lack of a dropper and the shallow seat tube, which restricts how far into the frame you can drop the rigid post, make it very hard to crouch low or move back into an aggressive descending position. On steep hills, this high positioning combines with a steeper head tube angle, 68.4-degrees, to make us feel destined for an OTB situation.

On rapid-fire hits, the rebounding bounce of the 29+ tires can shake your composure. Once you're prepared for it, it's a good reminder that you don't have any real rear suspension. So, you should probably slow your roll. A full suspension bike has more control over all surfaces. The Stache has that undampened bounce while rear shocks can be controlled by compression and rebound adjustments.

The Stache is slow to start but it keeps gathering speed, ramping up through the straightaways until we have to shut it down for a turn. We never topped it out, despite lots and lots of trying. Our downhill time trials were too wind affected to produce any results except for one. The Stache was undoubtedly the fastest climbing bike in the test.

When stacked up against the best trail bikes in the business, the Stache is ranked toward the bottom for its lack of versatility. The Fuse is a more composed and capable descender, though it only rates a bit higher in a field that includes full suspension bikes.

Climbing Performance

The Stache's upright positioning works better for the uphill. The 68.4-degree head tube angle translates to direct steering, and the 29+ tires roll right over rocks. Riders can just sit and spin most of the time, but you need power to do so. If you have it, the Stache climbs moderate hills with ease. Steep, punchy sections expose the inherent gravity of the rig. Two of our testers are comfortable climbing on the Stache . One feels the positioning is too upright and resents the lack of skill it takes to climb the trail.

In a word, the Stache's traction is "amazing." According to one tester, "if you spin out on this thing I don't know what to say." These tires are so big that you can run them at higher and more efficient pressures and while still enjoying the same grip you'd expect with 27.5+ wheels at lower psi.

The Stache is a solid climber but the Specialized Fuse is easier to accelerate. The smaller diameter wheels get rolling more quickly than the 29+ wheels on the Stache . The Santa Cruz Tallboy is a far more comfortable climber for long grids uphill. The lower weight of the normal 29-inch wheels save a lot of energy even if they sacrifice some traction.

Even though the Stache is a quad burner, the pain will be over faster than you think. The bike slogged to second place in our timed climbing trails, switchbacking up hardpack singletrack just behind the Specialized Fuse . It's still too tiring to want to take on an all-day climb, but it's certainly efficient enough to get up the hill for the thrill of coming back down.

The Stache's stiff rear end is enough to earn it a 5 out of 10 for climbing abilities, at the back of the hardtail pack and lagging behind most of the full suspension rigs. Most full suspension bikes are now adept enough at isolating pedal forces from their suspension action that they climb as well as a hardtail. In the case of plus size hardtails, maybe a little better.

Cornering, Handling, and Body Language

Piloting this green beast certainly takes some adjustment. One of our testers took a while to settle into the bike. Its tall rider position had him feeling too high above the trail and disconnected from the tires. After he figured out that the handling is precise if you can find a line that accommodates the bike's heft, he felt right at home. Another tester started out enjoying it, saying it steered as well as the Specialized Fuse , and ended up loathing it's imprecise cornering and heavy feel. The others enjoyed it throughout.

The Stache gets around uphill switchbacks relatively easily, it just takes forethought and a wider line. The traction and rock rollover skills make up for it's longer turning radius. The real challenge is muscling it around the descending turns. You have to plan ahead to find your line and aggressively lean into the turn.

The Bontrager Chupacabra 29 x 3" tires don't have the telltale bite of a cornering knob that so many bikers appreciate. The tread keeps rolling towards the sidewall of the tire, gripping the dirt at almost every angle. This is a great feeling for imprecise beginners and is functional enough for more skilled riders to appreciate.

Ease of Maintenance

It is important to consider maintenance costs and complications when purchasing a bike. Full suspension bikes have more moving parts and require more frequent service compared to the relatively simple hardtail bike. We consider the Trek's fork and brakes in the ease of maintenance scores below. Read more about the rankings in the main trail bike review .

The Trek Stache is a beautifully simple hardtail bike. Manitou recommends servicing their fork less frequently than RockShox options but more frequently than Fox. The bike's SRAM brakes are more difficult to bleed than Shimano.

Frame Design

The Stache 7 is 29+, 29 and 27.5+ capable, due to its stranglehold dropout chainstay adjustment system. This system lets the rear axle dropout slide 15mm fore and aft to accommodate different wheel sizes and a geared or single speed drivetrain. Similar chainstay adjustments are available on the Santa Cruz Chameleon and Salsa Woodsmoke . We tested the Stache in its longest chainstay iteration.

The Stache is a big bike, with its Alpha aluminum frame standing tall on 29 x 3" tires. We measured its bottom bracket height at 331mm and standover height at 850mm, by far the loftiest in the test. It also has the shortest wheelbase in the test, measured at 1118mm. The compact base is thanks to a steeper head tube angle, 68.4-degrees, and relatively short chainstays, 421mm in their longest setting. The shorter wheelbase balances the bulk of the bike's 29+ wheels. While the head tube angle is the steepest in the test, it's still reasonably slack. Pairing the relaxed head angle with a 120mm fork makes the Stache a more versatile trail bike than its traditional, cross-country focused predecessors.

A bend in its steep 77.3-degree seat tube makes the Stache's rigid seat post the tallest in the test. It makes moving back for descents a desperate affair despite the relatively short top tube, measured at 608mm. That's a bummer because the Stache's green-light color definitely stands for "on your mark, get set, go ."

The Stache's pretty good performance is matched by a pretty good component spec. There's nothing special here, but it all comes together nicely.

Cockpit and Fit — As we've mentioned, this is a big bike with an upright cockpit that sets you up in the stratosphere. The 18.5" frame size we tested works best for testers on the upper limits of a medium sized bike. You're not likely to lose that tall bike feel in smaller sizes though. The bottom bracket height doesn't drop any lower in the smaller sizes (17.5" and 15.5") and you only lose only about a centimeter in standover height for every size down. That's why a dropper post is such an important upgrade. The length of the bike isn't overly problematic, just don't expect to slap this green monster around on the trails without a fight.

Fork — It's nearly impossible to separate the performance of the 120mm travel Manitou Magnum Comp 34 fork from the squish of those 29 x 3" tires. They work together to provide plenty of squish. It's a passable fork. And, since it is so hard to separate its performance from the tires, it may well be a waste to upgrade to nicer fork on this bike.

Of Note: The reverse brake arch on the Stache's Manitou Magnum Comp 34 exposes more of the stanchions than their 120mm travel would suggest, adding about 30mm. This fork looks like it has 150mm of travel. It doesn't.

Wheels and Tires — The Bontrager Chupacabra 29 x 3" tires are wrapped around massive 46mm inner width rims. They don't lack any traction. The 28 wheel spokes seem light for such massive wheels. The tires might absorb enough impact to shield the wheel from any excessive beatings, and we didn't notice any flex, but we'd like the assurance a few more spokes would provide.

Groupset — The 30-tooth SRAM X1 crankset worked with the SRAM 10 to 42-tooth cassette to provide an adequate gear range for our testing purposes. The SRAM GX shifter and derailleur provided crisp shifts between them.

The SRAM Level brakes with centerline 180mm rotors shut the Stache's endless acceleration down effectively.

Handlebars, Seat, and Seatpost — The Bontrager Rhythm Elite 750mm bar is adequate, though on the narrow side, especially when stretched out over the front wheel on a 70mm stem. The combination worked fine for our testing purposes and gave the cockpit enough room to be comfortable on the climbs. Still, we would prefer a shorter stem and wider bar for better leverage to control that bossy front tire.

Build Options

There are some options when it comes to the Stache's build kit. Here's a rundown.

For $2,999.99 the Stache 9.6 gets you an OCLV Mountain Carbon frame, a RockShox Yari RC fork, SRAM Guide R brakes, and a KS eThirty Integra dropper post. The wheels and drivetrain are the same as the Stache 7 . The frame, brakes, and dropper are solid upgrades. We didn't care much for the Yari fork on our test bike the Kona Honzo . If you really want carbon, the jump might be worth it, but you could throw on a dropper on the Stache 7 for much less.

The 9.8 gets Gucci at $4,699.99 with the same carbon frame, a RockShox Pike RC, carbon Bontrager wheels, SRAM Guide RS brakes, and a SRAM X1 drivetrain. If you can afford it, this will certainly showcase the Stache's skills to their utmost.

For middle-of-the-road performance and a middle-of-the-road build, the Stache 7's $2100 price tag offers a middle-of-the-road value. This is a bike you could take on almost any trail (within reason) without as much upkeep as a full suspension.

Suggested Upgrades

We'd slap a dropper post on this bike before taking it out on its first ride. The ability to get low in the turns and back on steep sections of trail would make for a more pleasant ride. A shorter stem and wider bar would help wrangle the green beast. A different seat would make all that time in the saddle much more comfortable.

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Trek Stache 9 - long-term review

Big wheels + huge tyres = monster-sized fun

James Huang / Immediate Media

James Huang

Balloon-like 29 wheel-and-tire package floats over rough ground, excellent geometry, great suspension fork

Slippery tire compound, hard edges on saddle, burdensome wheel and tire weight, super-short rear end occasionally rubs on legs, expensive

‘Plus-sized’ mountain bikes are just barely breaking ground but Trek is already bucking the emerging trend with its new Stache 9 hardtail, slapping 3in-wide tyres on 29in wheels instead of the smaller 27.5in ones.

Cast aside your images of a slow and cumbersome machine though – the wheels and tyres may be huge but the Stache 9 is remarkably nimble and far more entertaining than you’d expect on paper. If your main goal is just having fun when you hit the trails, the Stache 9 just might be the bike you’ve been waiting for.

This ain’t no lumbering big-wheeler

The Stache 9 may wear Sub-Ringlé rims that are the same diameter as on a standard 29er but they’re nearly twice as wide and end up about two inches taller in total when you account for the matching 3in-wide Bontrager Chupacabra tyres. Given such a massive disparity, then, it’s no surprise that those huge feet large define the Stache 9’s personality on the trail.

The 45mm-wide rims and 3in-wide tyres make for a huge footprint on the ground

When you combine that bigger overall diameter with the huge increase in air volume and lower operating pressures – roughly 12psi for this 70kg (154lb) test rider – what you get is more akin to a hovercraft than a mountain bike in terms of isolation. With so much pillowy goodness underneath you, the Stache 9 positively floats over small-to-medium rocks and roots without so much as a hiccup to disrupt your flow.

Those bigger tyres also put more rubber – and more knobs – on the ground, and there’s a corresponding boost in all-around traction, depending on the ground conditions (more on that later). The Stache is impressively adept at technical climbing that might otherwise stifle a bike with less grip but cornering traction is especially good, particularly with the excellent 110mm-travel Manitou Magnum Pro suspension fork doing a great job of keeping the front tire firmly planted on the ground.

Manitou is back! The Magnum Pro fork is fantastic

The lack of similar movement out back (plus the tyres’ minimal tread) makes the back end occasionally prone to kicking out but all things considered, it’s generally quite controllable and yields heaps of tail-out hooliganism.

Those big meats are just one of the two characteristics that define the Stache 9’s personality, though; the other is its rather unique frame geometry.

Despite having wheels that are two inches bigger in diameter, the Stache 9’s radically shaped frame yields a hyper-compact and adjustable rear end. In its shortest setting, the chainstays measure a miniscule 405mm from bottom bracket to rear axle – a full 3cm shorter than a full-suspension Trek Fuel EX 29er trail bike with the same decrease in wheelbase.

The rear end is ridiculously short and makes for correspondingly ridiculous manoeuvrability

That stubby overall length makes the Stache 9 surprisingly manoeuvrable in tight quarters and unlike with most full-blown fat bikes, at no time does anything feel weird through the bars. It’s a piece of cake to flick the bike from corner to corner and even though the balance point is higher up off the ground, that ultra-short rear end still makes it far easier to loft the front end for bunnyhops and manuals than you might think.

Despite that agility, the Stache 9 is still confidently stable at warp speed. The front end is reasonably long, the head tube angle usefully slack, and the bottom bracket is quite low – and let’s not forget about the additional stabilising effect of all that rotational inertia.

Overall, the one word that best describes the Stache 9 is ‘fun’. Remember that friend you had in college? The big dude who dwarfed the rest of you in height and weight but could still keep up and was always the life of the party? That’s pretty much the Stache 9 in a nutshell.

You can’t escape physics

The Stache 9 is all about momentum. Between the terrain-flattening ability of the bigger and higher-volume wheel-and-tyre package and the extra cornering traction, you basically have to slow down a lot less than usual but you still have to get all that mass rolling initially. The bike isn’t especially hefty as far as trail bikes go with an actual static weight of 12.26kg (27.03lb, 17.5in size, tubeless, without pedals) but its substantial rotational weight can make it feel much heavier.

The Bontrager Chupacabra tires roll quickly but there's no escaping their substantial weight and inertia

Sun-Ringlé says each rim weighs 655g, the actual weight of the tires is nearly 900g apiece, and each tube is upwards of 400g (although thankfully, it’s easy to convert to tubeless). That’s about 800g of extra weight as compared to a typical 27.5in trail bike setup but it feels like much more when you consider the exponentially amplified rotational inertia effects of the Stache 9’s larger-diameter wheels.

Steady-state climbing at moderate speeds isn’t so bad as a result but it’s impossible not to notice the extra effort required to extract quick surges in speed. Crux moves where you need a sudden burst of forward thrust can be particularly challenging – hampered in no small part by the woefully slow-engaging DT Swiss rear hub. As Tom Marvin, tech editor of BikeRadar’s sister print publication, What Mountain Bike, puts it, “It’s not a bike that likes to be sprinted on.”

It might take a bit of extra effort to get the Stache 9 going but once it does, it's an absolute beast on rocks and roots

Trek has unfortunately also squandered away some of the inherent traction advantages of the 29 format with the Stache 9’s tyre choice. The Bontrager Chupacabras’ low-profile tread design produces impressively low rolling resistance, and both bites exceptionally hard and drifts predictably on softer surfaces. Those similarly low-profile cornering knobs can’t dig into hardpack as effectively, however, and without the benefit of rear suspension or a slightly squared-off profile to lean on, the back end is prone to stepping out suddenly.

“The lack of a proper shoulder was my biggest issue with the Chupacabra,” said Marvin. “I rode some fast grassy trails and it took virtually nothing for the rear especially to step out of line. That made it fun on fast swoopy trails where you could kick it out to look like a boss, but not so good in loose stuff.”

Bontrager supposedly has some more aggressive 29 tyre designs pending and they can’t come soon enough.

Fantastic frame, great kit

It’s taken Trek quite a bit of work to wrap the Stache 9’s alloy frame so tightly around those gargantuan wheels and tires. The seat tube closely follows the arc of the 3in Chupacabra casing, for example, and there’s a wafer-thin single-sided forging that just barely lets the non-driveside chainstay squeeze in between the tyre tread and crankarm.

Between the elevated chainstay and clutch-equipped rear derailleur, chain slap is kept at a minimum

Trek gained a few more millimetres by using the new wide-format Boost 148 rear hub and drivetrain spacing and even though the PF92 bottom bracket shell provides more real estate to spread things apart relative to a PF30 or conventional threaded shell, the driveside chainstay still has to be elevated to make room for the drivetrain.

There are dedicated forgings and intricately hydroformed shapes nearly everywhere you look, too, such as that non-driveside chainstay section, the neat sliding thru-axle rear dropouts (which also allow for singlespeed setups if you’re so inclined), and the way the top tube and seat tube flow into the adjoining stays. Meanwhile, the stubby tapered head tube allows for a reasonably low grip height. Cable routing is a mix of internal and external and it’s quite well done.

Frame designer Ted Alsop credits modern hydroforming techniques as the key to making elevated chainstays work long-term

According to Ted Alsop, the Trek engineer who designed the Stache, a large frame with all associated hardware weighs 2,025g (4.46lb).

That rather neat frame is dressed up in a solid mix of kit, too. Trek house brand Bontrager naturally supplies the Rhythm Pro carbon low-rise bar, forged alloy stem, lock-on grips, and lightweight Evoke RXL saddle but aside from that it’s all SRAM, Shimano, and other big names.

The SRAM X1 drivetrain delivers the same shifting performance and usefully wide range of the top-shelf XX1 package but at a far more attainable price while Shimano’s Deore XT hydraulic disc brakes – with bigger 180mm-diameter rotors all around – are as strong and reliable as ever.

Perhaps the most pleasant surprise, as alluded to above, is the Manitou Magnum fork. It’s amply stiff with its 34mm-diameter upper legs and stout cast magnesium lowers but it’s the performance of the internals that’s most impressive.

The bottom bracket shell and non-driveside chainstay stub are made from a single forging

Manitou says it designed the Magnum specifically from the outset for plus-sized tyres and that’s certainly a believable claim after six months of testing. It’s extremely supple off the top – largely canceling out the bounciness of the big tire casing – and highly controlled through the modest 110mm stroke. The spring rate also ramps up nicely as it approaches the bottom-out point and there are heaps of adjustments to fine-tune things to your liking, too – including air chamber volume if you’d prefer more spring rate progression. All in all, it’s a great little (big?) fork.

Out back is a DT Swiss 350 rear hub and it’d normally be tough to complain about finding such a bulletproof and proven unit on the spec sheet. However, Trek has neglected to request DT Swiss’s finer-toothed ratchet rings, leaving an utterly lethargic engagement speed in its ugly wake. It’s fine when you’re pedalling along but potentially crippling when the trail gets technical.

The adjustable dropouts allow for singlespeed running, too

Likewise, the KS Lev Integra dropper seatpost is a fantastic value-added inclusion – one might even argue that a dropper is more important to all-around trail fun than rear suspension – but once again, this one was problematic. Dropping the post went just fine but it regularly got stuck in the compressed position, only popping back up if you kept the lever depressed and bounced on the saddle. Not good.

That Evoke RXL saddle also has rather hard rear edges but aside from that, it’s a comfy and supportive place to spend your day.

Wicked fun but also conditions-dependent

How much you like the Stache 9 will likely depend a lot on the nature of your local trails. If you regularly find yourself on tacky dirt rollercoasters with endless high-speed ups and downs – not unlike the terrain in Trek’s Midwestern US headquarters, coincidentally – then the Stache 9 is almost guaranteed to get you grinning from ear to ear. In those situations, the rotating weight won’t matter much (and in fact, might even help) but the killer traction and manoeuvrability will be huge bonuses.

Riders constantly faced with lots of climbing, however, will invariably have a tougher time keeping those portly wheels and tyres turning over.

Either way, the Stache is still a fun machine and Trek deserves major kudos for delving so far off the straight-and-narrow to bring this to market. It’s not a question of whether the bike is fun to ride; it’s really just a question of how much fun you’ll have. In some ways, you can think of the Stache 9 like pizza (albeit a rather pricey one). When it’s good, it’s really, really good – but even when it’s bad, it’s still pretty good.

For more information, visit www.trekbikes.com .

Complete specification:

• Frame: Trek Alpha Platinum Aluminum
• Fork: Manitou Magnum 34 Pro, 110mm travel
• Headset: FSA IS-2, 1 1/8-to-1 1/2in tapered
• Stem: Bontrager Rhythm Pro
• Handlebar: Bontrager Rhythm Pro
• Grips: Bontrager Race Lite lock-on
• Front brake: Shimano Deore XT BR-M785 w/ 180mm RT81-M rotor
• Rear brake: Shimano Deore XT BR-M785 w/ 180mm RT81-M rotor
• Brake levers: Shimano Deore XT BL-M785
• Rear derailleur: SRAM X1
• Shift lever: SRAM X1 trigger
• Cassette: SRAM XG-1175, 10-42T
• Chain: SRAM PC-1130
• Crankset: SRAM X1 1400 w/ 30T X-Sync chainring
• Bottom bracket: SRAM PF92
• Rims: Sun-Ringlé Mulefüt 50SL, 32-hole
• Hubs: DT Swiss 350 Centerlock w/ Boost spacing
• Front tyre: Bontrager Chupacabra, 29x3.0in
• Rear tyre: Bontrager Chupacabra, 29x3.0in
• Saddle: Bontrager Evoke RXL
• Seatpost: KS LEV Integra
• Pedals: n/a
• Weight: 12.26kg (27.03lb, 17.5in size, tubeless, without pedals)

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Trek stache 7 29+ suitable for bbshd kit.

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Stache 7 as a single speed - any free hub issues?

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Hi all, Anyone having issues with freehub skipping on their Stache 7?? I set mine up as a single speed and am trying to isolate a skip in the drivetrain. New bike, so it has a new chain, new rear cog, and the stock 30 tooth ring in front. There's a Shimano splined freehub out back. Thanks!  

11 speed chain compatible with the cog?  

I think the chain is a 10 speed chain. From what I can read off the links, it's a KMC DX10.  

Still might be too tight, Surly, for example, recommends 8 or 9 speed chains for their SS cogs.  

Thanks! I have a Sram PC-971 (9sp) chain. I think I'll try that...  

Hi, where did you get the shimano splined freehub from? I would like to convert my 7 also to Singlespeed, but my dealer can't get that freehub...  

My LBS got it for me. *I did go out and buy a replacement wheel for the back... I got tired of the skipping issue with the Bontrager/Shimano skip I was experiencing. I picked up a wheel that also used the Mulefut 50 w/32 hole, butted spokes. No skipping.......yet.  

Did you double check your chainline?  

Chainline looks good, but I'll be checking out again since the new wheel set up. I'm still thinking about tossing the 9sp chain on.  

Def worth a shot. FWIW, I've had great luck with 8 speed chains on my singlespeeds. They are usually quite cheap and they last quite a while. So what is up with the hub on the factory Stache build? You aren't able to put a traditional cog on the freehub body back there? Just kind of curious since there is mention of some sort of special Shimano cog being used.  

The Stache 7 comes with a Sram 11sp drive train, so the rear wheel has an XD driver which is not compatible with the traditional SS cog and spacers.  

Ah...well that sucks. How much was the freehub and does anyone have any updates on the exact part info?  

My LBS did the ordering, so I'm not sure of a part number. I'll see if I can pull a number off it. My Bonti/Shimano setup seemed to skip under heavy torque. My weight and rear cog selection probably factored into the skipping - usually at the top of a steep climb at "barely making it" speed. I have a Shimano hub shell and Shimano freehub on there now. Time will tell (or a big climb) if it was the hub setup or some other factor......chain, wheel alignment, or cog alignment.. (which all looked good at the time)  

Hmmm...wonder if the wrong freehub body was installed or if it was possibly installed incorrectly causing that skip. Hoping others can chime in with their experiences on this as well. I'm looking to possibly buy a Stache later this year with the intensions of converting it over to single speed pretty much immediately and would rather not have to buy another rear wheel right out of the gate. EDIT: looks like the Stache 5 comes with a normal 10 speed cassette so should have the regular body needed for a simple ss conversion so I should be good. Still curious about the conversion body though.  

I'm also thinking about converting the Stache 5 to a single speed. What parts will need to be swapped out to make that happen? I've never done that before.  

Yea... The 10sp should be good to go.  

9, 10, and 11 speed chains have the same internal width dimension, so you would have to run an 8 speed chain to check the chain to cog tightness. What cog are you using?  

I have a Surly single speed cog (20t). Interesting Surly site SS cog info: "Our cogs will work with 6-9-speed 3/32" chains, although we recommend the inherently updated quality of an 8 or 9 speed chain." I have a 10sp chain on there now. To me, the current issue sounds (and feels) more like a hub "pawl" issue more than a chain issue. I can't imagine a new chain that's properly tensioned on new cogs skipping right off the bat. But I've been wrong before. I can't wait to get on some solid ground to test the new wheel set up!  

rdbandkab said: I'm thinking that if the 5 is a 10sp, you're golden. The "skimpy" spec sheet on the Trek site says it has a Shimano HG50 cassette. View attachment 1044718 No need for special parts. You should be able to peel the cassette and see a regular splined freehub. You should be able to slip a cog right on there (with the little spacers centering the cog of course). Maybe get a couple cogs for the rear so you can experiment. I'm not sure what rings come on the front of the 5, but the Stache 7 had a 30t front. I kept it and messed around with a 19 and 20t rear. (the OEM cassette had a jump from 18 to a 21). Click to expand...

It looks like the Stache 5 is a 1 x 10...with the front ring being a 32t. So you'll just have to see what sized cog you'll feel comfortable with out back. I use a 20t cog, but I already had a 30t ring in front (as it came as a 1 x 11). You might be good with a 21? 22? You'll have to get the spacers....as you will for any cog out back.  

Cool, sounds easy enough. Thank you for the help. I live in western KY, lots of rolling hills, but not major mountain climbs. What size cog would you recommend? I'd prefer to keep the front chain ring stock.  

Not sure what cog you would need, but maybe a 22 to start and see how that feels. If it feels too easy, go down a tooth or two. I bought a 19 and 20 to start. The 19 was ok, but a tad hard on steep switchbacks we have here. I went up to a 20 and it's about perfect for our local trails. *Again...I have a 30t on front.  

In case anyone's not seen it, there's a fair bit of single speed conversation on Staches in the 29+ forum: http://forums.mtbr.com/27-5-29/trek-29-coming-963127-44.html As mentioned above the 5 is easy to convert to single speed but the 7/9 less so. John  

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Best of Moscow by high speed train

By shuguley , February 15, 2014 in Regent Seven Seas Cruises

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Sure would appreciate someone who has taken "Best of Moscow by high speed train" from St. Petersburg could please share their impressions of this shore excursion. From the description this sounds like a very long day.

Wondering how the 4 hour train trip was in terms of accommodations, etc. Also what time did you leave the ship and what time at night did you return? Were both legs of the trip on the high speed rail (I read that slower trains also travel the same tracks)?

My wife and I are considering this excursion. We thought that if we are making all the effort to go to Russia then how could we pass up going to Moscow, walking in Red Square, seeing St. Basil, etc.

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If you are considering this on the 2015 June Baltic cruise on Voyager; my suggestion is don't. There is so much to do in St. Petersburg and although a train is one of my favorite ways to travel the time would be far better spent in St. P.

Thanks for the advice. Yes, this would be on the Voyager during the 2015 season but not yet sure exactly which cruise.

We did the Moscow excursion "on a different luxury line", but from your brief description it sounds very much like the same trip, so I will operate on that assumption. It is a VERY long day! We left the ship at 5:30 AM and returned at 12:30 AM. The highspeed train trip is comfortable, and while they call it "Business Class" it does not compare well to the equivalent class on say Rail Europe. When we did it in 2011, we did have highspeed both ways, and the trip back seemed much longer as the adrenaline and excitement had worn off!:D

Moscow itself is not that terribly different from any other big city in the world, but this Cold War kid never thought he would ever stand in Red Square, never mind walk the grounds of The Kremlin, or tour The Kremlin Palace, or see (but not visit) Lenin's Tomb, or visit The Armoury. But he did, and he loved every minute of it! Yes, it is a long day, and you barely scratch a scratch on the surface, but it is worth it. There is a tremendous amount to see in St. Petersburg, but every Baltic cruise goes to St. Petersburg, so you can go back if you choose to. Not every cruiseline offers you the chance to see Moscow.

I have not personally done this tour, but our last time in St Petersburg, the private guide that we hired for a day was leading the regent tour to Moscow on the high speed train the next day. He said it was way better than the previous alternative, which was flying to Moscow and back. He said that you actually got to Moscow faster because you didn't have to deal with airline checkin etc. it did seem like a very long day to me, and there is so much to see and do in st. Petersburg that I didn't consider doing it.

countflorida

We toured to Moscow from St. Petersburg via the hi-speed SAPSAN train last September, from a Baltic cruise on the Oceania Marina. You need to have a two-night, three day port call in St. Petersburg to take this tour because the tour typically leaves the ship around 5:00 - 5:30 AM and doesn't return until after midnight the next day. We didn't take the ship's tour; we made private arrangements with TravelAllRussia for three days of touring, the first and third days in St. Petersburg and the second day the tour to Moscow by train. Our cost for the private tour for three days was about the same as what the ship charged for the excursion to Moscow alone. There are a number of private tour agencies that operate in St. Petersburg and offer the Moscow train tours; we would strongly recommend them over the ship's tours.

All three days had private guides with car and driver. The second day, the driver picked us up at the ship and took us to the train, but we were alone on the train, and met in Moscow by the guide on the station platform. After our tour and dinner, we were brought back to the train and after the return train trip met by the driver and taken back to the ship. Because you are alone on the train you must have your own Russian visas.

If this is your first visit to St. Petersburg, I would agree there is much more to see there. We found Moscow somewhat a disappointment, particularly Red Square. The Kremlin and the cathedral in Red Square were also worth seeing. But the best thing we saw was the Moscow subway! I worked for the Washington Metro system back in the 1980s as it grew from 40 to 80 miles and although I was in the computer area, I learned a lot about the challenges of running a subway system. We used the Moscow system to get across the city from where we had dinner to the train station, and I was amazed at the cleanliness', speed of operation, the short headways maintained, and the courtesy of everyone involved. A very impressive experience!

We had been to St. Petersburg before, and so had the time to take a day and go to Moscow. Also, I really like trains, and the SAPSAN is a German train set running on Russian rails. Seats are like first class domestic air, spacious but not too plush or comfortable, but with enough room. Not too much recline, and almost 8 hours on the train in two shots is a lot for an old man. They come through and sell drinks, candy, etc. but the sellers don't speak English and no one around us helped, so we had just poor coffee once coming, and brought stuff with us for the trip back. Not too much to see from the train either, particularly on the return when it is night the whole way.

If you decide to go, take a private tour and avoid the overly expensive ship's tour. I'm glad we did it, but wouldn't bother to repeat the tour; we've seen Moscow.

Thanks so much to all of you for the thorough and thought insight. Yhe information you have provided is most helpful.

countflorida: Your detailed post is very helpful. We are not quite ready for a Baltic cruise but should do so within a year. Time enough to do our pre travel research, bookings and visa gathering.:) Thank you!

Emperor Norton

Sure would appreciate someone who has taken "Best of Moscow by high speed train" from St. Petersburg could please share their impressions of this shore excursion. From the description this sounds like a very long day.   Wondering how the 4 hour train trip was in terms of accommodations, etc. Also what time did you leave the ship and what time at night did you return? Were both legs of the trip on the high speed rail (I read that slower trains also travel the same tracks)?   My wife and I are considering this excursion. We thought that if we are making all the effort to go to Russia then how could we pass up going to Moscow, walking in Red Square, seeing St. Basil, etc.

I did this on Seabourn. IMO DONT. Take Aeroflop (er Aeroflot). The train has non folding seats where you are literally knee to knee with your fellow passenger (facing each other). Further they don't believe in air conditioning. It's also the worlds slowed bullet train. I think I would have found more enjoyment wandering around the St. Petersburg and Moscow airports.

Countflorida,

This is a little off topic,, however we had planned a river cruise in Russia but decided we would rather stay on land and have booked about two weeks with Travel-All-Russia using the private guide and driver. I'm curious as to how you found them as a tour company.

The guides they provided were fine. We had a different guide each of the days in St. Petersburg, but both were flexible, pleasant, knowledgeable and spoke English very well, as did the guide in Moscow, incidentally. She was a bit aloof, distant, not too friendly, but otherwise fine. In fact, she was the one who suggested taking the Metro, which unexpectedly became one of the highlights of the Moscow excursion. If I have a complaint with AllTravelRussia, it is with their plan and its execution (more later).

I had requested emphasis on World War II (in Russia, the Great Patriotic War) sites and info. In scheduling us, they weren't careful about dates and a couple of the sites we wanted to see were scheduled on the third day, after we'd been to Moscow. But both sites were closed that day of the week, and that info was readily available, right on web sites describing them. Also, the included meals (lunches in St. Pete, dinner in Moscow) were not what we asked for: light meals with some choices, so we could avoid things we didn't like and choose things we did like. My request was ignored; we were given full Russian meals with a fixed menu, no choice. On the first day, a fish dish was the entre, but I am allergic to fish. Fortunately, I had the e-mail I'd sent with me and showed it to the guide, and she was able to change my entre to chicken, which was very good actually. But we didn't want a 3-4 course lunches or dinner (in Moscow). We had the guide drop the lunch the third day, although we never got any credit or refund. But, particularly in contrast to the ship's tours, the prices were so reasonable we didn't worry too much about it.

The people who were on the ship's tour to Moscow saw us boarding the same train for which they were forced to queue up and wait on the way back, and asked us what we had done. I was candid and open so they were not happy when I explained what we had arranged and particularly what it had cost. Also, when we returned to the ship, we found they had laid on a late supper for those who had gone to Moscow, so up we went and had something. Well, it turns out the late supper was supposed to be just for those on the ship's tour, but we and others on 'independent' tours, there were a dozen or more of us, crashed the party, actually got there first, and they didn't realize it until the larger group arrived and there weren't enough tables/places set. By that time, the 'independents' had all gotten served and were eating; what could they do?

A couple from the larger group sat down with us and asked us about our tour, and they were the ones I told about our arrangement and its cost. They turned to others who’d been with them and announced the details, loudly enough so the whole room heard, which started a lot of bitching and complaining. I gathered they weren't very happy with the ship's tour to begin with, and this was the straw that broke the camel's back. We finished up and beat it out of there, but overheard later that one of the excursion staff came to check on something and ran into a real mess. I caught a cold on the trip, which forced me to bed the second day following in Tallinn, so by the time we reappeared we heard about the contretemps' but apparently no one recalled who started it, thankfully.

Because of what happened to us, I would probably not use AllTravelRussia if I were to go again, or if I did, I would be sure to get confirmation of every detail of the tour. They do have good reviews generally, and we were certainly helped by their visa department and liked the guides and drivers. Their weakness, I say now with full 20:20 hindsight, is that once the sales person who plans the tour, sells it to you and collects your money, he (or she) transfers the plan to their Russia office for implementation; there is no follow-up to make sure it gets done right. And that is where our problems arose; we paid for a custom tour but got a standard package with a few destinations switched, and no one checked them out, even to see when they were open the day we were scheduled to go. If you check every detail that’s important to you, it should be OK, but that’s a hell of a way to have to do business, in my opinion.

Thank you for the 20/20 hindsight observation on your Russian tour operator, and better priced than the ship's excursion cost.

Thanks very much for the feedback.

We had the same experience as you so far as price. We originally booked a Viking Cruise but, hearing some things about the river cruises that made us unhappy, looked into other options. T-A-R cost the same or less than a cruise and had us in hotels for 11 days. We opted for the private tour. They have three tour levels, based on hotels. We originally opted for the four star as it did not cost much more than the three star hotels. Finally we decided to throw it all in and upgraded to five star. In Moscow we will be at the newly opened Kempinsky which is two blocks from Red Square. In St. Petersburg it is the Grand Hotel Europe, one of the most vaunted luxury hotels in Russia. Location is important for us as the tours use up only part of the day so being in the center of everything for our independent touring is important. As with many other cities, the less you pay, the farther out of the center of town you are.

We have been working with our salesman in D.C. and he seems to get back to us with the changes we want. He recently returned from Russia so is up on everything. When I asked they said they paid the full TA commission if I wanted so I got my usual TA on board so he is watching our back and giving us that extra level of comfort. He also set up our air, which I know pays him little or nothing, and got us business class for much less than T-A-R wanted for economy, though it took working for a while with a consolidator. He's happy to get his 10 percent on this trip without having booked it. He also took care of the trip insurance. We've been doing a lot of research on the CC sister site Trip Advisor and will write a report there. We will, I guess, become a source of info for CC members after having spent 5 days in Moscow and 6 in SP.

• 4 months later...

scubacruiserx2

Anybody considering a day trip to Moscow from St. Petersburg on the Sapsan may want to look at our travelogue filled with pictures.

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1927687

Very informative. Thanks dor sharing. Jeff

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• Conversion Kits
• Conversion Kits General Discussion

nvm moscow throttle

• Thread starter Widget2k13
• Start date May 3, 2020

Finding my (electric) wheels

hi everyone, im new to the forum and have come with a question about the ncm moscow, i have owned the bike for over a year now and seen that the moscow plus has a throttle fitted to it, does anyone know if its possible to fit one to the normal moscow and if so where to purchase what i need in the uk as i cannot find anything about it at all. thank you  

Esteemed Pedelecer

Show us a pic of the main controller and it's wring not the handle bar display.  

i will get some pictures tomorrow, i know its a sealed unit and one wire goes to the pedal crank and another goes away inside the frame  

hi, here is a pic of the control box, not sure if it helps, one wire goes to the motor, one to the pedal crank and the others go up to the battery area  

Attachments

All I see is a BB shell with two cables running under it.  

its a sealed unit fixed to the frame, there is no way of getting into it i dont think  

In that case then a throttle can't be retrofitted if there isn't an unused three wire connection.  

The Oxygen ST uses a similar frame which is likely a generic China/Taiwan frame utilised by other companies with different components and motor kits, the Oxygen is throttle capable.  

Widget2k13 said: hi everyone, im new to the forum and have come with a question about the ncm moscow, i have owned the bike for over a year now and seen that the moscow plus has a throttle fitted to it, does anyone know if its possible to fit one to the normal moscow and if so where to purchase what i need in the uk as i cannot find anything about it at all. thank you Click to expand...

Kommunikation zwischen C7 Display und Motorkontroller NCM Venice+ Das-Kit

An lcd won't enable you to fit a throttle, you need a controller with the wired out put for one as well as the PAS out put. One can't be used for the other.  

jokskot said: It is possible to fit a throttle by tapping into the cable linking the display and the controller fitted near the bottom bracket and I have done so . See post 8 in the attached link for circuit schematic & background info.: Kommunikation zwischen C7 Display und Motorkontroller NCM Venice+ Das-Kit Moin, ich habe bereits im dem 'anderen' pedelec und E bike Forum meine Untersuchung und Ergebnisse veröffentlicht, hoffe aber hier zusätzlich noch weitere interessierte Leute zu erreichen. Zunächst einmal ein Dank an Arthus Dent der schon vor über einem Jahr damit angefangen hat und auf dessen... www.pedelecforum.de Google translate will deal with the language if your German is not up to it! You need to put 5 v (from the purple and black wires across the throttle Hall sensor and attach the Hall sensor signal wire to the yellow line. If you have a voltage display on your throttle and it has the range up to at least 60 v, you could also tap into the red wire of the cable to display the battery voltage. Unfortunately all you achieve with this, is having the "walk" function (ie 8 or is it 6? kph) available via the throttle. It should be possible to increase the speed available by resetting the firmware but this is beyond my ability & competence! I have posted (under the same nom de plume as I use here) in the link given above but no usable feedback has been provided. If anyone reading this & can help with this, please post here or send me a pm. Click to expand...

Das-Kit e-Bike Conversion Kit, 48V 500W | Leon Cycle

At a price....!!!! Possibly the motor available in the US has more power, but I suspect the rest is just firmware tuning. You've probably noticed the flash screens you get on switching on, include one that says EU300 or something which I take to be an EU compliant firmware version.  

jokskot said: At a price....!!!! Possibly the motor available in the US has more power, but I suspect the rest is just firmware tuning. You've probably noticed the flash screens you get on switching on, include one that says EU300 or something which I take to be an EU compliant firmware version. Click to expand...

Kosh said: Yes on all counts ! Click to expand...

WheezyRider

Nealh said: An lcd won't enable you to fit a throttle, you need a controller with the wired out put for one as well as the PAS out put. One can't be used for the other. Click to expand...

Kosh said: Hello just out of interest , i bought a Moscow at the end of May and was also looking into fitting a throttle , looks like the answer is no, not without changing the Lcd unit (as far as i can make out) there seems to be no info out there (did find something in German) and any questions to Leon cycle's go unanswered, i got the bike ok (tracking did not work) but am hoping i dont get any problems as i dont think Leon are going to be any help ... awful customer service ! very happy with bike though ... done couple of hundred miles to date (mainly cycle tracks) let me know if you find out anything more re throttle .... thanks Click to expand...

WheezyRider said: Have you been able to get into the setup mode with the DAS KIT LCD? Codes I've seen are 8088 and 8018, depending on the unit. Then you can set the wheel diameter properly. Leon Cycles will not tell you this, I only found it on the web. Click to expand...

jokskot said: I’d be interested to know where you can get the correct 8 pin Julet connector from in China. I was unable to locate one in China, but did find a good supplier in Germany. However fitting a different display is likely to cast £50+ & may not solve the problem of speed available via the throttle. I was luckier than you with Leon and they provided a few pass codes to try. 8018 worked for me, accessed after pressing the + & - keys together for a few seconds. Difficult to describe but pretty intuitive! This allows changing the voltage (if you really want), the wheel diameter and power which essentially limits the current supply. I have found little different between the “turbo” & normal, but “eco” limited the current indicated to 5 bars rather than 6 and made hill-climbing more demanding on the rider. If you change anything remember to press the + & - buttons together to save the changes and return to the standard screen. Has anyone got experience of flashing firmware on microprocessors and could offer me guidance? ( see earlier posts in this thread and posts elsewhere on this site by me) Click to expand...

Electric Bicycle E-bike Waterproof Cable Connector For E-brake Display Throttle | eBay

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